As some of you know,
In the email, I told him that I didn’t want to have to witness anything like that again, and that it would be better if he and I did not find ourselves in the same locations at the same time. Pretty fucking straightforward.
Well now, three days after I sent the email, he’s responded.
He’s completely fucking clueless. He actually wants me to have the people he “may have offended” contact him, and recount *exactly* what he did, so that he can “tailor my words personally to each as dependent to the offence.” Yeah — his response to being told that he’s crossed the line and presumed a level of intimacy that he hasn’t earned…..is to demand one-on-one communication with the people in question.
He’s also told me that he’s still going to come around, and that I should just deal with it.
Any of you who are willing to bother, comment below, or email me and I’ll give you the asshat’s email address.
Personally, at this point, I’m completely of two minds about this: Part of me wants to email him back and lambast him for being a socially-inept Asperger’s case, who doesn’t understand that it makes zero sense to want to go to gatherings where it’s OBVIOUS that he is disliked. The other part of me says to ignore the email and just be done with the whole damned thing…including not going to any gatherings where he’ll be present, because I don’t want to bring drama and/or violence to someone else’s space.
Advice?
A certain portion of his response to you is not surprising. If someone had warned you not to come around an event they were going to be at, you may very well have the same sort of “deal with it” response to them, or possibly worse, depending on the circumstances.
Lambasting him would not make any further dent than the previous email. This is plain from the example of how many times it has taken saying “no” before actual boundaries were set, and that’s assuming said boundaries are actually honored going forward, and I doubt they will be.
If you choose to email him a second time, do not lambast. Simply state that his response, requesting individual and personal interaction with those he has offended is indicative of the basis of the issue at hand – that is that he does not recognize social boundaries, and that you have forwarded his request to those who were invovled and it is up to each of them whether they wish to address it directly with him.
With regard to future events, if you are going to refrain from attending for this reason, I think that you should communicate your reasoning clearly to the potential host/hostess, so that they understand that this individual’s presence is curtailing the attendance of others, and that you are choosing not to attend out of respect for the host/hostess, so as to not bring negativity to their gathering. An unfortunate decision, but most probably necessary.
D.
I understand your desire to not share a space with this person–and I wasn’t even at the party!
But you can’t tell him not to attend a party he’s been invited to. The only thing you can do, should you see him at an event, is remove yourself.
Basically, yeah, what said.
I will only say to you what I said to him. Do what you feel like. Say what you want to say in your own words. Whether or not it’s acknowledged and listened to is up the the other party.
That being said, I had the honor of reading your reply email. And almost giggled in his face. Well done. And yes, it did sail right over his head. AGAIN.
I’m surprised he wanted communication. And I think if he asked for it, and any of the offended are willing, then he should get his chance.
But to paraphrase something one of my very wise friends recently told me, he does deserve a chance to own his own shit. If he can be made to understand how he crossed boundaries and what they are, perhaps he’ll recognize them better in the future. If no one has taught him in the past, and no one will now – how will he ever learn.
And perhaps he won’t deal, won’t understand/learn/recognize. But that won’t be your karma.
True. Which is why I went ahead and posted this, so that those who feel like they have the energy/time to try and educate him can get his contact info and wade into that, should they so desire.
Personally, I find that at the age I’m at now, I’ve got better things to do than act as belated socialization instructor to assholes. I haven’t got the time to waste on what their parents, family and friends should have taught them in childhood and adolescence.
I have emailed him and told him that I’ve forwarded his offer — making sure to add the whole “social-boundaries” thing that suggested in her comment.
Of course, being me, I also added that my mind was made up, and that he should (direct quote) fuck off and take his wife with him.
Icon LOVE, by the way. (Big surprise, right?)
Indeed everyone does deserve the chance to own their own shit and to clean it the fuck up.
Being one of the people he offended, however, I choose not to take it up with him directly at this point…wholly because his responses to others who have stated there was a problem directly to him only elicited an entrenched, worse behavioral response.
This wholly illustrates that particular individual has no wish to recognize that there is a problem and that the problem lies with his choices. If I do make the choice to be in a social situation with him in the future (which I don’t know that I will do so) and he does cross a line with me, however, I will, in no uncertain terms and phrases small enough for even a ego-ridden Leo geekboy to understand, not only cut the legs out from under him, but also put the stilleto boot in his precious arrogant ass in a way that he will know exactly how he fucked up and exactly what it proves of him to have done so.
D.
Generally, I have no qualm about signposting to others; however, I generally only do so when there is some indication that such a thing will actually make a dent in the worldview of the person involved.
Considering what has passed thus far, I sincerely don’t believe that anything anyone has to say to this individual will elict anything more than further arrogant obnoxiousness.
Sadly in such cases, usually the only thing that gets through is truly losing contact with every person who might have once interacted with them (and even then it sometimes doesn’t make a difference).
D.
You have spent way more time and energy on him than either of them deserve. Really. They aren’t going to learn until it is put into practice, and who cares if they do, anyway?
There are plenty of already fit companions in the world.
Color me clueless…
What the hell happened and why didn’t someone tell me? I do not like my favorite peeps upset :(
Re: Color me clueless…
Pretty much as stated: Many inappropriate comments, which crossed the line by presuming a level of personal intimacy that has not been earned.
Personally speaking, I didn’t tell you for two reasons:
1) You had invited him, and it’s not my place to criticize your choice of guests. It’s your home, and therefore I keep quiet.
and
2) I had decided (as I said in the above post) to simply let it go….until told me on the drive home about being the subject of some of his comments. Turns out that she waited until we had already left to tell me, because she knew what my reaction would be….so, in retrospect, this was a good move on her part.
Re: Color me clueless…
I’m just done with my last client and back to the ‘puter until class starts…
I am sorry to hear this. I was completely unaware.
Frist, let me say that these parties are an open LJ invite and that does not make people personally invited, just welcome. Please, please let me know if someone is behaving badly, I then have the opportunity to deal with it at the time (unless, of course, I am stupid drunk). I mean, it. Please do me the courtesy of informing me of the behavior of those in my home so I can prune the invites if needed.
Second, you two have become two of my favorite people. I like having you around. Perhaps this is my wake-up call to have more smallish gatherings instead of infrequent largish ones.
I will not loose your company over something like this.
Re: Color me clueless…
You’re one of our favorites too….which is why we didn’t want to rock the boat.
I didn’t find out about this whole issue til after the party, however, I was being abnormally antisocial the entire time. I may have physically injured the person had he done something similar to me. (I was also abnormally grumpy that night)
I’m a big fan of not wasting much more time on the situation. Either he will get it or he will not.
Love you tons, hope to see you soon!
Rock the boat
Geez, I think we used to do the “bump” to that tacky song in the 70’s…(oh the pain of memories)
Gareth, thanks for bringing it to my attention.
>>I haven’t got the time to waste on what their parents, family and friends should have taught them in childhood and adolescence.
And of course, it is the job of those people you mention above. You are none of those things and don’t even WANT to be. So yeah. Other than protecting your OWN family and friends, you don’t have to do anything. :p~~~~ to him.
Oh, and the icon: after the last bout of gay porn (squee!), I had to go looking for some yummy superman pics. I am still trying to find some of comic Clark. All the pics of him I keep finding are from movies.
I only know of this situation what I’m reading between you and. It seems that a lot of really good advice has come your way thus far.
If those he(they?) has offended decide to communicate to him exactly how he crossed personal boudaries, giving him the opportunity to own his shit, I hope he makes the choice to do so. You’ve opened it up to that, and that’s probably all you really can do on that front.
Love,
Natalie
Re: Color me clueless…
Star, I think the majority of people who have had a problem with this particular individual have all been working to simply be laid back about it. He generally shows the hallmarks of a geek who doesn’t understand social boundaries, with an overtone of obnoxious cluelessness, and we’ve all bumped into those sorts of people now and again. His behavior at this last party was more of the same, just amped up past the point of people wanting to put up with it, but no one wants to be the person who brings negativity to bear in your space, out of deference and respect to you.
That he brings such behavior into your space indicates that he does not have deference and respect for you.
One of the things I have noted about these parties as they have gotten larger and the number of people attending has grown, is that there has been an increase for me of the number of people I am not familiar with and more recently an increase of people I am not necessarily comfortable with. It has over time, changed the tone of these experiences for me, which I find somewhat disenheartening.
That of course, is my own personal issue, and should have not have a bearing on who you choose to invite into your home. However, I did want to voice my support for a possibly more exclusive invite list, particularly for get togethers designed to be a mite more freewheeling in nature…because unfortunately some people do not understand that even within a freewheeling environment, trust and intimacy is something that is earned, not something given gratis because someone happened to set foot in the door.
D.
And…
you put into words so eloquently what is banging around in my brain.
There is a part of me that is such a social butterfly that I don’t mind the mix of known and unknown energy. There is also a part of me that misses my people and I need to create time for more intimate socialization with those I trust.
I’m working it through and putting together different boundaries to meet the range of needs I have. I guarantee the “post-Faire” party will be for me and those I consider trusted. Because I will have missed you all and will need a fix!
Thank you for adding wonder and joy to my life, not to mention deep introspection. Grateful to count you friend.
~S
Re: And…
Love you, you know.
*big squishy hugs*
D.
:)
I know.